We'll pick u. Gandalf was going to announce that Sauron had found the Ring. 2463, Saruman was appointed its leader.Even then, he had begun to sense the resurgence of Sauron and to envy and desire his power, and especially his One Ring.Coincidentally, in that same year the One Ring was found by the creature Gollum, drawing the Dark Lord closer to the conflict that would eventually prove Saruman's undoing. These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. Got caught and lost a mind-to-mind battle. Telchar, an uber Dwarven smith who lived in the first age, forged Narsil. He would have also learned where the Fellowship was broken and knowing the Ringbearer's true purpose would assume his destination would be the Black Gate which indeed it was until Gollum convinced Frodo otherwise. Much of Sarumans history in the Second Age is mysterious. The thing is, that wouldn't be a simple task. Indeed, Saruman needed no ring to become enslaved. This is the real reason the eagles question will never die: Its too appetizing for The Lord of the Rings fans. Although he never appears directly in the books and is only shown in the movies in a flashback to the War of the Last Alliance, his corruptive influence is felt nearly everywhere in Middle-Earth. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. I also assume that Sauron would have eventually won the war. Unfortunately, Sauron had got on the wrong side of a particularly powerful race: the Nmenreans.The isle of Nmenr was a realm of men that sat apart from Middle-earth and those who lived there were more powerful than the men seen elsewhere in The Lord of . Hes of the same order of beings as Sauron, so he certainly has enough power to effectively use the ring. A limit involving the quotient of two sums. At the beginning of the story, Saruman is more powerful than Gandalf. It didn't have to shoot out lighting bolts to be an uber blade. His Spirit would continue in some astral realm, and would use His real weapon: TIME. Not true. Even still, Frodo set the benchmark for hope and volunteered to take the One Ring to Mordor, where he destroyed it and saved the world from disaster. That's when the Rohirrim attacked, allowing the Hobbits to escape into Fangorn forest. Had Isuldur done the wise thing, and pitched that sucker in the crack of doom, that would have been it. He sees the Dark Lord as a rival and also an aspiration. Ultimately, we dont know who the Stranger is, aside from being an Istar, or a wizard. We dont know if the Stranger will make it to his destination and the show could certainly deviate from lore or invent new history ( as it has done already). But maybe thats a reason why hes Saruman and not Gandalf. :)#LordoftheRingsWhatIf #Saruman #WhatIfSaruman But why do I think the Stranger is Saruman? Anybody else who bore it (non-stop) would eventually be drawn to him, where he would get the Ring back. Tolkein himself said that it would have been a difficult battle, and might have gone either way, but that One of the true great powers could have dedfeated Sauron by using the Ring. He could turn invisible and go slowly crazy, which seem to be the width of the one ring's powers. However, Saruman had planned his rise to power much earlier than that. Hes lost his way in a search for greater power. The Mystics, believing the Stranger is Sauron, tell him he must go to Rhn to fully explore his powers. Already Saruman had a lust for power and even desired the One Ring for himself. - his malice and domination, or something like that. He also had control of the nine kings and such or was supposed to, although didn't Elrond get a ring yet was present at the battle? What percentage of recruits fail boot camp? No one could even comprehend the length of His existence. Their power was in preserving and healing the hurts done to the earth, and to those who were harmed by evil. But it will still never truly be his & he will have to continually fight to dominate it as the One Ring wants to return to its master, who cannot be banished until the Ring is destroyed. He'd have used his bird spies to scour the area and sent out Uruks on wargs and men on horses. He caught up with the orcs and destroyed them in the early hours of the 29th. Privacy Policy. Despite an erratic and feeble end, for long he was one of the wise, and for long desired the ring; he could not possibly have failed to consider Sauron's response. She seems to have seriously pondered what she might do if she got hold of the Ring, and she was only an Elf, not a Maiar like Saruman. Although Saruman had selfish motives, he didn't expect to fall so deep . He now lives with his family in Lynchburg VA and is an avid outdoorsman. If you know how to use it, its an *extremely* powerful magical artifact. That he will never do now.". He would have been able to control more people, and he would have had a much easier time dominating their wills. He definitely volunteered to go to Middle-earth first. The one ring would have made him more like what he was before he left on his mission to middle-earth, only corrupted and evil. )https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpgaqH-cKuqvfKr1NL-yudg-----Don't forget to check out our Official website!www.thebrokensword.co.ukIf you want to support the channel, you can help us on our Patreon page. Sauron was stronger than Gandalf the Grey, but . Now, consider Saruman. If a law is new but its interpretation is vague, can the courts directly ask the drafters the intent and official interpretation of their law? After a comment from Gimli, Gandalf adds: "But Isengard cannot fight Mordor, unless Saruman first obtains the Ring. Knowing where he ends up would make the Strangers current journey all the more fascinating. If Saruman masters the ring, he will have a chance of defeating Sauron. Even though Frodo had a 4-5 day head-start further east and would be entering the Dead Marshes on March 1st, Saruman would also have had a head-start on everyone else in terms of knowledge and certainty. It does not store any personal data. What happens next? (Letter 246). By clicking Accept All, you consent to the use of ALL the cookies. (OK, just a Numenorean with the largest army and navy in all of history.) The Witch-king of Angmar was the leader of the Nazgl, or Ringwraiths, and the right-hand man of Sauron through much of the Second and Third Ages of . Courage to ones fellows, hope in adversity, and comfort to the suffering were the powers enhanced by the three. Galadriel) might have been able to master the ring. So all of the vanilla staves will get a retexture that adds a new color depending on their enchantment. He starts on a similar path as Gandalf, but his choices and hunger for power lead him to evil. It may not display this or other websites correctly. Thus, while Gandalf taking the One Ring would have expediated the destruction of Sauron, it also would have hasted the subjugation of Middle-earth. It may have taken a while to learn to use the Ring to its full potential, and Sauron would surely have put everything he had behind trying to get it back, but itd be iffy, and he certainly couldnt use the Nazgul or other ring-empowered creatures against the weilder of the One. In the book it is sort of implied that certain beings with sufficient power (e.g. The villain created The One Ring, where he put most of his power. Rohan would've fallen to Saruman and wouldn't have been able to come to the aid of Gondor and helped make the final stand against the forces of Mordor at the Black Gate. Saruman with the Ring would presumably have tried to do what Tolkien says Galadriel or Gandalf might have done, if they have succumbed to the temptation of accepting the Ring: "they would have built up an empire with great and absolutely subservient generals and armies and engines of war, until they could challenge Sauron and destroy him by force." Gandalf and Galadriel both seem to think that they could take the One, and replace Sauron - if they can so could Saruman. Saruman used the seeing stones(palintir) to keep up with Sauron, as did Boromirs Father (name slips me now), Sarumaon would be no more than a snivinling fool of Sauron. That success would be the usual bitter victory, though, because first the new wielder of the ring would need to build his own power, and learn the mastery of the ring. If Saruman had not been corrupted in the first place, the war might have gone much easier for the Free Peoples. For one, the Ring wasn't a tool or a weapon of war that anyone could use for anything. Sauron once again lay dormant for over a millennium in the Second Age, secretly preparing another attempt to take over Middle-earth. Heck, the great among the Elves, or even Aragorn, were considered very credible threats by Sauron. Gandalf wasn't even sure if he would be able to break his staff in The Return of the King, and that was a very weakened version of Saruman. The key thing to note is that Sauron, by the time of the War of the Ring, lacked the ability to take a. I would not be too sure that Sauron would be the victor, as Saruman spent long years in study of ring-lore. The Palantri. Which probably wouldn't have happened. Gandalf had the last one, though Im not sure anyone but Cirdan, Himself, and Elrond and Galadriel knew it. Other uncategorized cookies are those that are being analyzed and have not been classified into a category as yet. Gil Galad, and the last alliance also defeated Sauron, without the help of the Maiar, as well. Why didn't they bring the Ring to Valinor? In those, Saruman appears to harness the weather to command the snowstorm on the pass of Caradhras that dramatically halts the progress of the Fellowship. What is a word for the arcane equivalent of a monastery? Five wizards came to Middle-earth, so the Stranger could be any of them. Again Aragorn refuses it, apparently without any internal struggle whatsoever. If Saruman had the ring and he learned to master it, he could rule Sauron's armies and servants as it says in The Fellowship Of The Ring. What would have happened if Saruman had gotten his hands on the One Ring? He believed he could fake an alliance with the Dark Lord while ultimately finding the ring for himself and ruling Middle Earth. In Rivendell, Frodo all but offers the Ring to Aragorn, saying Then it belongs to you, and not to me at all! (FOTR260). What happens next? 2023 Minute Media - All Rights Reserved. It basically lets them look unique according to their enchantment. The cookies is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Necessary". It would be difficult for Sauron. Yet, it's also possible that Sauron would have triumphed and regained the Ring for himself. The One Ring has a number of powers and depending on what information (particularly regarding the Middle Earth RPG) you will get very vague to very specific capabilties for the One Ring. Answer (1 of 13): If Saruman acquired the One Ring and had time to learn to use it, then he would go to war against Sauron. After all, they would both want the other one's full and utter . When Gandalf sent Frodo and the Hobbits to Bree in The Lord of the Rings' opening act, he had the fullest intent of meeting them there. As Sauron once was, Saruman, a Maia of Aule, became absorbed in Ring-lore as he studied Sauron's evil works. That was a lucky hitand did you perhaps notice that Sauron was more or less single-handedly beating the entire Last Alliance army at that point? Is Gandalf the Gray's power actually limited or did he merely promise to not use it? Sauron originally made the One Ring to enhance his ability to influence and suppress or control the wills of other beings, specifically the Children of Ilvatar (Elves, Dwarves, and Men). After that, in the Undying Lands, Sauron was more powerful. You would have both Saruman and Sauron focused in the same area and it is very unlikely Frodo would have escaped that level of scrutiny even with Gollum leading him on secret paths. He and his servants already knew of his involvement in the attack on the Fellowship and the capture of the hobbits. Still, this is a point to consider. They got the identity wrong, but the Stranger felt the direction about Rhn to be accurate. What would happen if Gandalf had the ring? Thus, the power of the Ring is both direct (like the power of a weapon) and symbolic (like the power of a cult object). Anybody else who bore it (non-stop) would eventually be drawn to him, where he would get the Ring back. The thing is, it's worth wondering what would have happened if Frodo had failed. Forces from Mordor and Rhun would have been sent to fight their way through Rohan, leaving Minas Tirith undefeated to the south. I say this because Saruman would never have destroyed the ring and so the ring would have eventually consumed him since Sauron was its true master. But what if the Stranger is a different wizard we all know from The Lord of the Rings? Sauron was not a run of the mill foe and an ordinary blade wielded by an ordinary man would not have sufficed. Please don't forget to subscribe to stay up to date with all future content! For these reasons, Tolkien tells us, the Nazgul (powerful though they were) would have hesitated to attack Frodo directly, after Frodo finally claimed the Ring for his own. We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup, Latest Blog Post: Jacks Bad Movies Black Adam (2022). He reasoned that his total control of Middle . If Gandalf proved the victor, the result would have been for Sauron the same as the destruction of the Ring; for him it would have been destroyed, taken from him for ever. If he succeeded in doing that, Sauron would have been defeated because it was his saving anchor. Sauron is the primary villain of The Lord Of The Rings. One other Seeing Stone has been accounted for: the Stone of Minas Anor. Sarumaon told Gandalf that a new power was rising and noone could srand and therefore they should join that power. When given the opportunity It would betray Its wearer, and find Its way back to Its Master. Why does Gollum calling the ring his own not alert Sauron? Although this is never explicitly stated, Galadriel alluded to the Fact that Gandalf, . Eomer had no clue about rings and quests. Either way, the battle between them would have been a catastrophic lose-lose situation for everyone. The Rise Of LOTR's Witch-king Of Angmar. By the time we meet Saruman in The Lord of the Rings, hes up to no good. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. He and Nori leave for the land in the east at the end of The Rings of Power season one finale. This is what Sauron feared that his enemies would do, if they got the Ring; and that's the only reason he feared them. We'll probably never know. Lots of great, exclusive content, even discounts on our original merch! Why are non-Western countries siding with China in the UN? It wasn't really a surprise. What if: One of the primarch's had landed on the world of Avatar the Last Airbender. Had Isuldur done the wise thing, and pitched that sucker in the crack of doom, that would have been it. When it comes to the Stranger, played by Daniel Weyman, we learned he is one of the Istari, but we did not learn his actual name. Letter 246 describes a hypothetical confrontation between a hypothetical Ring-bearing Gandalf and Sauron: Confrontation of Sauron alone, unaided, self to self was not contemplated. House of Dragons vs. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Short story taking place on a toroidal planet or moon involving flying, Acidity of alcohols and basicity of amines, The difference between the phonemes /p/ and /b/ in Japanese, Replacing broken pins/legs on a DIP IC package. Does he use his great voice, enhanced by the One to subjugate the free peoples. In the case of vague powers the One Ring would enhance one's powers based on one's strengths. We know that disobedience can bring ruin such as what happened with the Noldor when they disobeyed the Valar or the Army of the Dead when they disobeyed Isildur and broke their oath to fight for him. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. "Greetings, Naruto Wraithslayer, wielder of the Faerdagnir. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. Please message us if we have not credited you! Which routine is best for gaining muscle? Nor do we how long would it have taken for Saruman to master the powers of the Ring. So, it seems Sauron is not invincible, even with the ring, much less against it. In the hypothetic situation where Sauron thought, or knew, that Saruman had the Ring, I think he would have responded in a similar way. (Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age, The Silmarillion as far as the quoted material here goes). They were basically the teachers pet ones who lived closest to the Valar and did not trouble themselves (except once) with the problems of Middle-Earth. Gil Galad, and the last alliance also defeated Sauron, without the help of the Maiar, as well. He will likely go through some things, but that would mean the Gandalf we meet in the Second Age is largely the same as the Gandalf in the Third Age. What money is available for senior citizens? Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. And in The Rings of Power, when the mystics realized their error, they said the Stranger is the Istarnot one of the Istari, the Istar, as if only one is present in Middle-earth right now. Come join us to discuss the works of Tolkien. JavaScript is disabled. Saruman was known for being subtle in speech (with a powerful ability to sway others with his voice) and skilled in smithcraft. Sauron was stronger than Gandalf in the Lord of the Rings, but it has to be said that there were a few different shapes of both characters. It might be that if Saruman had the Ring he would, in a Maiar way, then become Sauron in the same way. Science Fiction & Fantasy Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for science fiction and fantasy enthusiasts. Soon (convenient term, soon) I will begin on the second volume of The Lord of the Rings, The Two Towers.It consists of two 'books', The Treason of Isengard and The Ring Goes East.The first 'book' of the volume deals with the adventures of Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas as they go in search of Merry and Pippin; this puts them all in conflict with the traitorous wizard Saruman's machinations. But he didn't because Eomer disobeyed his king and destroyed an orc band that had the most crucial thing needed by both Saruman and Sauron - information. In this scenario, Sauron likely would have recovered his Ring and covered all the lands in a second darkness. We dont know any details about his activities in Rhn or his other easterly travels. On the surface, Saruman seems like one of the simplest Lord of the Rings characters to define. These cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads. I dont find it terribly exciting that Gandalf arrived in Middle-earth and was good from the beginning (with Noris help). How successful would Saruman be finding and capturing the Ringbearer in this scenario is speculative but one has to wonder would Sauron not notice this activity. I would think that Saruman, a Maia, would be in that category. We learn that Denethor, steward of Gondor, had used the Palantir to divine knowledge of the Enemys movements only just before the steward burns himself alive. Doom. We look at sections of The Lord of the Rings and Tolkien's letters to answer the question - what would happen if Sauron reclaimed The One Ring? So what's a few millennia. 1. Some interesting conjecture, but you're forgetting that if anyone replaced Sauron as the "master" of the One Ruling Ring, they would sever Sauron's tie to the ring and essentially reduce him to an ineffectual spirit who could no longer interact with the physical world. **Chief among the powers of the ring that were feared by the White Council was the fact that if Sauron put it on now, all that had been done by the Wise using the three rings would be revealed to him, as would their minds, if they did not take off the rings. Saruman is one of few "grey" characters in the books, meaning he's neither gone fully evil or good. Maybe, though i dont know that much about Sauman's power and. Was the "Eye of Sauron" Sauron's actual physical form? That makes Gandalf more or less like we know him from The Lord of the Rings, thousands of years in the future. Narsil was made by the dwarves not elves. Imagine that, after breaking of Fellowship, Saruman`s Uruk-Hai capture Frodo and bring him, with the ring, to Isengard. Saruman probably would have become the dominant power in Middle Earth and turned it into a pretty crappy place to live. By this Tolkien shows that disobedience for good reasons has merit. The first and most obvious reason Galadriel gets to hang on to her Ring - Nenya, the Ring of Water - from beginning (i.e. That Saruman is nothing like the Stranger who falls from the sky in The Rings of Power. The chapter is a partly published version of a manuscript now held at the Marquette University (MSS 4/2/31-37); [1] other parts of this manuscript and a time scheme have been included in The . Either way, the good guys loose big. By the time of The Lord of the Rings, Saruman has become jealous of Sauron's power (and Gandalf's too). If any artists would like us to remove their artwork, or add anything additional to credit you, please contact us and we will sort it straight away! But opting out of some of these cookies may affect your browsing experience. 1 What would have happened if Saruman got the ring? Today we jump back in time to one of our older videos at one of our What If scenarios! I'm a little vague on this point. Do new devs get fired if they can't solve a certain bug? Do you want to be the first who gets the news directly to your mailbox? In Tolkiens writings, they came across the sea. . By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. The White Wizard -- at the height of his power -- could have been a match for the Ringless Dark Lord. What happens next would depend on Sauron himself; whether he would seek to retake the Ring immediately; whether he would visit Saruman himself or send a lesser servant. Yet, he had something that needed to be done first. It was his own and under his will. There's the slight possibility that Saruman would have given the One Ring to Sauron and served as lieutenant to the most powerful being in Middle-earth. Tolkiens complex writings and retcons dont reveal a crystal-clear answer about Saruman arriving first, but if you go by The Silmarillion, Saruman did. In Tolkiens work, Saruman went to Rhn, shortly after he arrived in Middle-earth, in factjust like the Stranger.